The rules for opening churches are being challenged by a number of religious leaders, including Fisher and the Anglican Archbishop of Sydney Kanishka Raffel.

They are also pushing Health Minister Brad Hazzard for an exemption to the 70 percent rule on the grounds no one should be turned away from church.

We told the government that worship was "an essential service, not mere recreation" for many people, Fisher says.

"We explained that all our faiths are inclined to allow all comers to worship, that many pastors and faithful would be uneasy with restricting worship to the fully vaccinated and that doing so could prove very divisive," Fisher says.

"Race, gender, ethnicity, age, education, wealth or health status (including vaccination) must not be points of division within the Christian community or barriers to communion with Jesus".

Hazzard, however, is standing firmly the state government's ‘roadmap' out of strict lockdown.

Making exceptions on religious grounds seems unlikely.

Under the roadmap, Deputy Premier John Barilaro says only fully vaccinated people will "have access to the freedoms allowed".

Listed under the freedoms for fully vaccinated adults was that churches and places of worship could open subject to one person per 4sqm rule, with no singing.

Masks will remain compulsory for all indoor public venues, including churches and on public transport, retail and business premises.

Some ministers of religion have also publicly contemplated civil disobedience if the government keeps the requirement.

"Churches have a responsibility to minister to all, regardless of immunisation status, so we will be discussing with government how we can fulfil that ministry commitment in future stages of the recovery," Raffel says.

"We want everybody to be safe at church, but we also want to make sure we minister to everybody."

Fisher says he is committed to ensuring a safe return to worship for everyone and is working with a leading infectious diseases and risk management specialist to help plan for this.

Last week before the roadmap was announced, Anglican minister Phil Colgan, said he could not imagine a scenario in which he would turn away parishioners who weren't vaccinated.

"Even if it is consistent and churches are treated the same as cinemas … I still question whether the government has the right to impose on churches something we don't accept.

"I think it's really important to note that all of our acceptance of government limitations to date I consider to have been voluntary ...

"But there might come a time, like with a vaccine passport for me, where I would say ..., 'no'...

"I can't ever see a time when I would deny someone access to fellowship on the grounds of their vaccination status."

Source

• Sydney Morning Herald
• Catholic Weekly
• Image: The Australian

Francis, who sat for the interview with AdnKronos on Tuesday (Oct. 27), said, "Our relationship is really good, very good, and we agree on what needs to be done."

He said that he often visits Benedict at his Vatican quarters in the Monastery of Mater Ecclesiae.

Ever since Benedict XVI shocked the Catholic Church and the world when he stepped down after fewer than eight years as pope, the notion of two popes living inside the Vatican's walls has fueled speculation and division, as Benedict, often portrayed as a conservative, became a reference point for Catholics who object to Pope Francis' more progressive worldview and approach.

The unique situation has also drawn the attention of filmmakers, authors and journalists seeking to explore the relationship between the two white-clad prelates as a symbol of broader tensions among Catholics.

But Francis once again attempted to set the record straight. Benedict, Francis said, is "sanctity personified," and dismissed reports of petty rivalries. "Anyone can say and think what they want," he added.

But Francis said that in their first visit after his election, his predecessor handed him a "large box."

"Everything is in here," Benedict said, according to Francis, "the documents containing the most difficult issues, I have come this far, I acted in this situation, I drove away these people and now… it's your turn."

The interview comes as Francis has begun to press harder to resolve the situations Benedict referred to. On Sept. 27, Pope Francis accepted the resignation of Cardinal Angelo Becciu, once among the most powerful prelates inside the Vatican, who was accused of embezzlement and nepotism in a widening scandal in which powerful financial interests have been connected to Vatican officials.

"The Church stays strong," Francis said in the interview, "but the topic of corruption is a deep issue, going back centuries."

His interview also comes as Francis is weathering criticism from conservatives for spontaneous remarks on civil unions for LGBTQ couples he made in a new documentary film, "Francesco," not long after Fratelli tutti, his latest encyclical, raised eyebrows for its strong advocacy for the rights of immigrants and refugees and his patronage of the environment.

While admitting that "no one likes" criticism, especially when given with "ill faith and malice," Francis said he believes "criticism to be constructive" and a helpful tool for discernment, which he described as the "guide in my journey on everything, on everyone."

While he said that he thinks about his legacy, "it's also true that if I must find inspiration to do better in criticism, I surely can't be dragged down by every non-positive thing they write about the pope," he said.

The pope also addressed the "days of great uncertainty" posed by the coronavirus. "I pray a lot, I am very, very, close to those who suffer. I accompany with prayer those who help people who suffer for their health."

Francis added that he is concerned about COVID-19's possible long-term impact on the Church, saying that he'd heard from a bishop that Catholics are "losing the habit" of going to Mass due to lockdowns and may not return to church when the pandemic ends.

If the faithful came to Mass out of habit alone, he responded, perhaps it would be better if they don't come. But he predicted a better outcome.

"Perhaps after this difficult trial," he said, "with these new challenges, with pain entering people's homes, the faithful will be more true, more authentic. Believe me, it will be so."

• Claire Giangravé - Vatican Correspondent RNS. First published in RNS. Republished with permission.